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11/18/2022 9:56 am
I almost had a Super-O this morning ! Or maybe it was a mild, short one. Whatever it was, it felt good and very encouraging. I might be getting out of the slump, after all. I did not “break” any connections. Hurray !
How did I get there ? By following my own advice. I can almost hear eyes rolling and people looking at the sky. Of course, it’s not that simple. Recent chats, things I wrote, things I read, things I told others to do, things they told me to do… I think the trigger was this post in @hankey01's thread. Then @tbob's post right under, where he tells us he had to learn things and unlearn others.
I want to stress once again that this has little to do with how *I* do things, or whether my own advice is any good for you. This is immaterial. The whole point is that unless you apply the principles, really put them to work, they are just words on a screen, or ink on a page.
How many times did I write in the last few months that porn is just colors in a box, that it's not real, that it does not do it for me anymore. Yet I give it a shot once in a while, and it does nothing, it's fake, I don't enjoy it, and if it does not get me aroused, then I don't go for as session, because I think my libido is not there. If I know it's junk, if I tell others it's junk, why do I expect it to be a good start to a session ? This means I don't truly "know" it, I just... entertain the possibility that maybe it makes sense.
This morning I felt the tiniest drive to have a session, looked at some porn and it was about as arousing as watching paint dry. I closed the browser window, decided to give it a shot anyway, and lo and behold, I had a good session with a solid erection, and nice feelings, which sadly were interrupted by me losing focus thinking about writing a forum post. Yeah...
Now I know that I'm done with porn, and I won't lose any more time with it. I can cross that one from the list. But I had to go from "porn is OK", to "porn with sound off", to "glancing once in a while", to "only to start a session" to "this absolutely does not work for me anymore. It's kaput." It's a learning process. It's work, and sometimes it takes several tries. No amount of NNN or "Your brain on porn" documentaries could convince me, I had to do it on my own.
I'm 100% sure that someone, somewhere, is not touching his penis enough, or is relaxing too much, or is too aroused, or his expectations are too low, or he's not flexing hard enough, because that guy "thinks" he knows things. Unless you truly know, you're going to stay stuck...
11/18/2022 10:54 am
Oooh quite profound today! 🙂
I almost had a Super-O this morning ! Or maybe it was a mild, short one. Whatever it was, it felt good and very encouraging. I might be getting out of the slump, after all. I did not “break” any connections.
The only way from rock bottom is up my friend.
I think the trigger was this post in @hankey01's thread. Then @tbob's post right under, where he tells us he had to learn things and unlearn others.
Sometimes you have to destroy something to be able to rebuild it.
I want to stress once again that this has little to do with how *I* do things, or whether my own advice is any good for you. This is immaterial. The whole point is that unless you apply the principles, really put them to work, they are just words on a screen, or ink on a page.
This is an absolute gem of advice imo.
How many times did I write in the last few months that porn is just colors in a box, that it's not real, that it does not do it for me anymore. Yet I give it a shot once in a while, and it does nothing, it's fake, I don't enjoy it, and if it does not get me aroused, then I don't go for as session, because I think my libido is not there. If I know it's junk, if I tell others it's junk, why do I expect it to be a good start to a session ? This means I don't truly "know" it, I just... entertain the possibility that maybe it makes sens
Except for the outliers,it likely ruins things for a lot of ppl. I’ve often found it strange that ppl say they need porn to get aroused for a session. For the life of me,I couldn’t work out why they can’t just think of some titties and away they go. If porn isn’t providing the arousal needed to reach orgasm,then one already has a problem with it. Not to mention the amount of focus it eats when that focus is required by the body. It eats pleasure,motivation,positivity,everything 🙁
Now I know that I'm done with porn, and I won't lose any more time with it. I can cross that one from the list. But I had to go from "porn is OK", to "porn with sound off", to "glancing once in a while", to "only to start a session" to "this absolutely does not work for me anymore. It's kaput." It's a learning process. It's work, and sometimes it takes several tries. No amount of NNN or "Your brain on porn" documentaries could convince me, I had to do it on my own.
Not unlike the journey. Certain parts can only be accessed by the individuals by themselves no matter how much advice they’re given. I’m glad to hear you’re binning the porn. No you can rebuild your super o! 🙂
I'm 100% sure that someone, somewhere, is not touching his penis enough, or is relaxing too much, or is too aroused, or his expectations are too low, or he's not flexing hard enough, because that guy "thinks" he knows things. Unless you truly know, you're going to stay stuck
Or he doesn’t hold any tension hahahaHah couldn’t resist 😉 Great post Zentai,seems you done some figuring out and arrived at some clarity.
Topic starter
11/18/2022 11:22 am
Not to mention the amount of focus it eats when that focus is required by the body. It eats pleasure,motivation,positivity,everything *sad face*
At the end of the day, you need as much focus as possible on the prostate and good feelings from your body, and staring at "the brain eating rectangle" just won't cut it. It can work for some outliers, it worked for me until it did not. But none of my best Os involved pornography, not last year, and not back when I started. This should have been obvious, but it was not, because I stuck to pre-conceived ideas.
Certain parts can only be accessed by the individuals by themselves no matter how much advice they’re given.
Exactly ! I'm a bit sad you did not add, "Unfortunately, no one can be told what the Matrix is. You have to see it for yourself." I'm sure you were itching for it, hehe 🙂
Or he doesn’t hold any tension hahahaHah couldn’t resist *wink*
Yep, what I think is happening is that those who think they are 100% relaxed are still holding some residual tension. If I manage to be really-really relaxed. then there are no invols. I'd theorize that for most people, there needs to be some amount of tension no matter what. And of course too much tension locks everything in place. I think strain-relax-strain is a good compromise in the beginning, until you get more acquainted with the flow of muscles contracting and relaxing.
Great post Zentai,seems you done some figuring out and arrived at some clarity.
>Thanks ! Like this ? Come Clarity.
Faith-Manages reacted
11/18/2022 12:05 pm
interrupted by me losing focus thinking about writing a forum post.
I do that too!! So irritating. I have some other thoughts that keep popping into my head. Basically the worst thing imaginable..least sexy though I can muster keeps popping in..because I am trying to think abot what not to think. It happens when I can't sleep too. It's literally the worst visual thing I could imagine...just because I don't *want* to have thoughts like that. STUPID BRAIN!
I am sorry to hear you are struggling these days. 🙁 The newb that I am assumed the non-newbs had it all mastered.
11/18/2022 1:01 pm
If I manage to be really-really relaxed. then there are no invols. I'd theorize that for most people, there needs to be some amount of tension no matter what
Geez the more I learn about others the more I learn about myself. This I find quite profound, for me involutaries are instantaneous. Usually start in the center, then move to the sphinc, sometimes both. Sometimes light sometimes deep, they bring some good vibes, doesn't matter though, just feels good to have your ass dance on its own. My body changes tension on its own. I swear I can't contract my sphincter as tight as my body can, it feels like its kissing my prostate at times , iknow its not , but I can;t physically do this myself. I know for me, the best is when they stop, or anchor them self, and the feelings come.
Sorry to hijack this thread a little. one of the points here is , its very easy to give advice, harder to take it. Even harder sometimes to implement it. Being open to it is most important. Another thing is others experiences, help to read btwn. the lines of our own.
11/18/2022 1:49 pm
Exactly ! I'm a bit sad you did not add, "Unfortunately, no one can be told what the Matrix is. You have to see it for yourself." I'm sure you were itching for it, hehe
I try not to be cheesy,but screw it ha ha.
I think strain-relax-strain is a good compromise in the beginning, until you get more acquainted with the flow of muscles contracting and relaxing.
The bulk of relaxation needs to happen up top,not the body imo.
>Thanks ! Like this ?
All I am offering is the truth.Nothing more.
11/18/2022 1:57 pm
Sorry to hijack this thread a little. one of the points here is , its very easy to give advice, harder to take it. Even harder sometimes to implement it. Being open to it is most important. Another thing is others experiences, help to read btwn. the lines of our own.
This is it. All of the advice,the tools,the techniques are just raw materials. Each guy must use the materials to build his super-o. He can’t carbon copy someone else’s,he can only build his own.
Topic starter
11/18/2022 2:15 pm
one of the points here is , its very easy to give advice, harder to take it.
I think you told me this before, and I did not take the advice. I could hunt down a thread where you even advised me to take my own advice. Which I knew I needed to do already, but the stubborn Ego was not having it...
Sorry to hijack this thread a little.
Un-hijacked Aneros Forum threads do not exist. It's a myth ! I was getting worried for a bit, I was just about to hijack it myself, lol ! The exchange of ideas is what is important, but even more important is the implementation and testing of ideas.
I know it's not, but I can't physically do this myself.
Well, YOU can, since YOU're doing it. The question is, why you cannot do it consciously, or why it feels stronger when you are giving up control. After all, YOU use the same body your subconscious does. So, what's happening here ? This could be a question that you can't answer for now, but I think some kind of mind-obstacle is in the way.
Geez the more I learn about others the more I learn about myself.
We're not as different from others as we might think. I don't believe we're all the same consciousness experiencing the Universe, but there's at least some things we can all agree on. Maybe some of them could lead to Super-Os ?
11/18/2022 2:42 pm
I know it's not, but I can't physically do this myself.
Well, YOU can, since YOU're doing it. The question is, why you cannot do it consciously, or why it feels stronger when you are giving up control. After all, YOU use the same body your subconscious does. So, what's happening here ? This could be a question that you can't answer for now, but I think some kind of mind-obstacle is in the way.
When my body does it on its own, it comes with the intense feelings. That might be the difference. Feels like the 2 sphincters are kissing in the middle. No matter how hard I push or pull I cannot create this on my own. And I have a great command of muscles down below.
11/18/2022 2:52 pm
When my body does it on its own, it comes with the intense feelings. That might be the difference.
Nothing wrong with that. This indicates perhaps obstacles are in the mind,not the body.
Topic starter
11/18/2022 3:56 pm
I do that too!! So irritating. I have some other thoughts that keep popping into my head. Basically the worst thing imaginable..least sexy though I can muster keeps popping in..because I am trying to think abot what not to think. It happens when I can't sleep too. It's literally the worst visual thing I could imagine...just because I don't *want* to have thoughts like that. STUPID BRAIN!
Yeah, that sucks... We're not the only ones dealing with the overthinking and parasite thoughts. The worst thing is that the changes required to eliminate this might require important life decisions and lifestyles changes. Not easy...
I am sorry to hear you are struggling these days. *sadface* The newb that I am assumed the non-newbs had it all mastered.
Well, one can know exactly what needs to be done, but without the drive or energy to do it, or if "real life" gets in the way, then technique is not the issue. Like when an athlete needs some rehab after an injury before he can get back in the game. He can coach but can't play... After full recovery, if all goes well, then he can hope to play at the same level as before he got hurt.
Dundie reacted
11/18/2022 6:19 pm
How did I get there ? By following my own advice. I can almost hear eyes rolling and people looking at the sky.
Well I'm not eye-rolling (but I get the apprehension), I think this is such an individual journey, that I've often wondered how much any of us can really help each other at all. I know some of my own roadblocks have been so weird and impossible to guess at, even from inside my own brain... what chance does anyone else have at unearthing them?
I'm 100% sure that someone, somewhere, is not touching his penis enough, or is relaxing too much, or is too aroused, or his expectations are too low, or he's not flexing hard enough, because that guy "thinks" he knows things. Unless you truly know, you're going to stay stuck...
I think the trap with thinking you know things, is that you might in fact know things, but fail to appreciate how they might only apply to you, or the version of you at a certain point in time. I think all we can do is continuously compare notes, with each other, and with ourselves from the past. But I think we have to forgive ourselves for some of this too, since we are all on the cutting edge of discovery, and walking an uncharted path.
I think the spirit of discovery and the will of people to help each other is overall heartening, what ever else happens.
Reddog152 reacted
Topic starter
11/18/2022 8:20 pm
I know some of my own roadblocks have been so weird and impossible to guess at, even from inside my own brain... what chance does anyone else have at unearthing them?
Yes, some of these things are really arcane, or they require a personal interpretation that no one will be able to make for you. I'm still under the impression that it's possible to guide another man until he's quite close, but crossing-over is maybe impossible to teach. At least to me, it's quite a feat of mental gymnastics at time.
But I think we have to forgive ourselves for some of this too, since we are all on the cutting edge of discovery, and walking an uncharted path.
Wise words. Sometimes we do know very little, and it's frustrating, but how could it be otherwise... for each of us, this is a unique adventure and as they say, the map in not the territory. Advance knowledge is a pretty scarce resource in some situations.
I think the spirit of discovery and the will of people to help each other is overall heartening, what ever else happens.
I agree, this is a very wholesome community !
11/18/2022 8:25 pm
I would bet if we all had the same vocabulary, mine is so weak, ti wouldn't surprise me how much more simular, are exp's are. Thats why I encourage everybody to describe what works and doesn't, in there posts. No matter how silly it sounds or if its been described a thousand times before. You may have just the way of saying it that will really help somebody. I have read some pretty long winded posts, myself included, that only 1-2 sentences really resinated with my exp, and gave me the fresh point of view, I often need. I think coming here for me is like a form of porn. Because alot of time i'll be reading a post and boom aless kicks in, i can vica ilously live your orgasms quite easily. Well there it is your all my little whores.LOL I should send ya's flowers, if I could kiss ya's I wood.
Reddog152 reacted
Topic starter
11/18/2022 9:04 pm
I would bet if we all had the same vocabulary, mine is so weak, ti wouldn't surprise me how much more simular, are exp's are.
Maybe, maybe not. After years we can hardly agree on what a P-wave is... and we cannot show each other these things. I bet this is why the ancients "invented" Chakras, third-eye, wheels, Kundalini, concepts such a Nirvana, etc. They needed a common vocabulary. We can't just use these concepts as they don't make sense to everyone, neither can we just mix and match them. It's quite the challenge.
I agree that often there is a small nugget of knowledge in a post, even if it's from a raw beginner. I still get surprised quite often with new bits of info, and sometimes people will write in very few words what I would write in 2 paragraphs.
Like you I would really like to see more contributions, but for... ahem... somewhat different reasons, hehe !
Tbob reacted
11/20/2022 10:45 am
Sorry, I just had to add a Matrix reference, haha. Awesome discussion!
Helghast reacted
11/20/2022 12:18 pm
I've often wondered how much any of us can really help each other at all.
Here’s the trick,help is a two way street,cooperative. All the guys will try to help a guy,and they can use experience to do so,but the guy must help himself too. Ive seen ppl come here and disappear quick,I’m sure you have too. I think they come looking for a silver bullet,don’t find it,and give up. This journey is a long road with few shortcuts,and requires dedication. Does the exploration ever end? I don’t think so.
11/20/2022 1:18 pm
I mean,the werewolf might still want the silver bullet,but I’m not sure I’d recommend it.
11/20/2022 6:53 pm
I think they come looking for a silver bullet,don’t find it,and give up
Or they find it and thats the only reason they came. This is still pretty taboo stuff for some guys. My guess is many ppl that come here, aren't secure in there sexuality. Pulled out of the matrix as it were
Helghast reacted
Topic starter
11/20/2022 7:27 pm
Yes, I'm sure it happens. A guy is open enough to buy an Aneros and use it, but not enough to just go : "Hey guy, let's all talk about putting stuff up our butts and leaking precum everywhere, amirite fellas ? " It can be a big leap for sure.
11/20/2022 9:22 pm
If I manage to be really-really relaxed. then there are no invols. I'd theorize that for most people, there needs to be some amount of tension no matter what.
Among the many pitfalls for newbies, this is one. It almost fits under the "Expectations" category. Literally embodying a "do nothing" method and then thinking "why is nothing happening?", fully expecting that doing nothing is the "one true path". OTP is itself a falsehood.
I think the trap with thinking you know things, is that you might in fact know things, but fail to appreciate how they might only apply to you, or the version of you at a certain point in time.
Anyone read how to deadlift, how to cook a recipe? You'd reviewed the procedure the day before, convincing yourself you knew what to do. What's missing is the kinesthetic sense, the proprioception, the live feedback. So you had in fact learned something, but it was knowledge in stasis, frozen in an ice cube. You needed to provide bodily and mental heat for it to come alive.
Many posts contain details for which you can experience two "reads". The first, before rewiring or at least gaining some body-knowledge. And come away with a different understanding or new things to try after you've experienced some things themselves. There aren't enough hours in the day for me to chase down all I'd read pre-rewiring, to inform it with Helical v.2 . Wish there were.
Yes, some of these things are really arcane, or they require a personal interpretation that no one will be able to make for you.
The second half, for sure. We each need to discover our bodily truth for ourselves. But the first as well, reading all of this arcana such as for the non-medically-affiliated, the many muscle names.
I have read some pretty long winded posts, myself included, that only 1-2 sentences really resinated with my exp, and gave me the fresh point of view, I often need.
I still get surprised quite often with new bits of info,
Some of us writing long winded posts are grappling with what is happening within ourselves : ) We may feel we've experienced a revelation but it doesn't translate so well for our would be reader. Who of us here has had a relative say, "there isn't an English word for (x in their mother tongue)"? Glad there's capacity for surprise.
11/20/2022 10:20 pm
I know it's not, but I can't physically do this myself.
Well, YOU can, since YOU're doing it. The question is, why you cannot do it consciously, or why it feels stronger when you are giving up control. After all, YOU use the same body your subconscious does. So, what's happening here ? This could be a question that you can't answer for now, but I think some kind of mind-obstacle is in the way.
When my body does it on its own, it comes with the intense feelings. That might be the difference. Feels like the 2 sphincters are kissing in the middle. No matter how hard I push or pull I cannot create this on my own. And I have a great command of muscles down below.
OMG, yessss! That is such a distinct feeling that is like straight rocket sauce during a session. Can't seem to actively hunt it down but when it occurs it's spectacular.
Tbob reacted
Topic starter
11/21/2022 8:59 am
Who of us here has had a relative say, "there isn't an English word for (x in their mother tongue)"?
Haha, I don't need a relative to do this, I deal with that je ne sais quoi all the time. Give me some telepathy and an hour or two and I would make almost anyone into a believer. But with language and interpretation limitations, it's not so easy.
One true path is garbage. Everything works for someone, and nothing works for everyone. There's probably a workable, close to universal approach, but it would only work as a methodology which you can use to determine what combination of tools will work for a particular individual. It would only be universal in a larger sense. There is no "10 steps to the Super-O" that works for everyone. If I'm convinced of one thing right now, this is it. Once you find your path, it makes so much sense and it's so darn obvious that it's almost unthinkable that it should not work for others. If they follow it and it does not work, then they are Doing It Wrong (TM). Maybe a do-nothing-er and an active approach guy might just be speaking different languages, but they will definitely agree on some things. That's the stuff worth focusing on, the bits that work for almost everyone.
Many posts contain details for which you can experience two "reads". The first, before rewiring or at least gaining some body-knowledge. And come away with a different understanding or new things to try after you've experienced some things themselves.
Definitely. Just like when @Helghast and I talk about his "next place" which is my own "outer realms of Os", it's a bit awkward because there's this distinct feeling that some guys will just believe we're smoking DMT or something... But those who know, know, and it will make sense to them.
Faith-Manages and helical reacted
11/26/2022 6:26 pm
But none of my best Os involved pornography, not last year, and not back when I started. This should have been obvious, but it was not, because I stuck to pre-conceived ideas.
I think to a degree a lot of the generalities of Aneros use gets caught up in the reverse of what you are explaining.
I'm not sure if the Wiki directly says it, but I have read many members say that you must be aroused in order to have a great session. And while I understand that there are many ways to get aroused aside from porn, they all lead back to the same notion - viewing or imagining fake situations to gain sexual pleasure. Seems to me like if that doesn't work for you, it isn't at all across the board.
So what now...? I've read so many people on here talk about having these Aless sessions with nothing inserted, or these mindgasms that are based on something entirely different than pressing play on a porn, inserting a toy, and getting to work. Some seem to be using visualizations that are completely separate from sexuality, but almost in a more spiritual realm.
This breaks the mold. Then it isn't as much about getting yourself in the mood as it is clearing space in your mind for something pleasurable to come in? Is this an indication that we can very well just pop in a model, relax, and experience the same Super Os those using porn are receiving?
Since I think you have had a ton of up and down experiences, give some insight as to what tools are needed to replace arousal, if that at all makes sense. Because it is seeming over time that the way Aneros is being used is shifting, and we are finding out new pathways to success that aren't listed in the Wiki or instructional content.
Faith-Manages reacted
Topic starter
11/27/2022 1:06 pm
Super-O are all about manifesting pleasure, and while arousal prior to starting a session is not absolutely required, if you cannot build some arousal during the session, then you're unlikely to get any result.
Ideally, the session itself should be arousing, if you are completely neutral towards the session to the point it's no more exciting than just doing anything else, again, it's unlikely to pan out. I think that if you can approach it as being at least as pleasurable as jerking off, it's already a good start.
There is nothing that will replace arousal. A different point of view could be that it does not have to be *sexual* arousal and that the anticipation of having a good experience, or spending some quality time with yourself, or relaxing, should be enough to get things started until they build up.
You already said as much yourself :
Then it isn't as much about getting yourself in the mood as it is clearing space in your mind for something pleasurable to come in? Is this an indication that we can very well just pop in a model, relax, and experience the same Super Os those using porn are receiving?
Since using the Aneros stimulates areas of the body that are linked with sexual pleasure, then it stands to reason that this is the most direct path one can take. But not all pleasure is sexual in nature. If it's easier for you to have fantasies about things that would make you happy rather than working on sexual fantasies, then it is as good an approach as the sexual one, it will just be less obvious than the more direct one.
12/01/2022 2:40 pm
Since using the Aneros stimulates areas of the body that are linked with sexual pleasure, then it stands to reason that this is the most direct path one can take. But not all pleasure is sexual in nature. If it's easier for you to have fantasies about things that would make you happy rather than working on sexual fantasies, then it is as good an approach as the sexual one, it will just be less obvious than the more direct one.
This is an interesting approach.
In another recent thread, people were looking for an e-book about male orgasms. I download it and read through. Part of the book have exercises were you can almost create a sense of arousal through things like smell, taste, and touch. While we deal with the touch aspect a lot in the rewiring the Wiki speaks of, I think taking these senses outside of sexuality and somehow bring them back to sexuality is kinda neat. I wonder what the mechanics of all that is.
On a separate note, I did try a session last night, free of porn and any stimulation. I found it a bit easier to clear my mind. Something along those lines of maybe not trying to make it happen. Unfortunately, I didn't get outstanding results, but I was able to bring in some sensations that I have not had in previous sessions.
I think I will continue to trend a few more times just to see where it leads. Either way.. Not that I'm a porn addict or anything, but creating situations where you can cut down on consumption is always good.
Zentai reacted
Topic starter
12/01/2022 3:34 pm
This is an interesting approach.
It's all about starting with the easier stuff, and for sure, sexual arousal is the simplest path. But if it does not work for some reason, then it makes sense to jump through more hoops to recreate the same circumstances. I've seen it happen in real time for me, back when I was younger and all it took was "thinking about tits", to where I am right now and there is more of a system and rituals to follow to make it work.
I think that the association of smell and taste is pretty simple conditioning, see Pavlov's dog. I don't know how strong the link can be and how powerful the effect will be, in other words, could this be a game changer or more of a gentle push, that's hard to say. You'll maybe remember some users here getting pleasurable feelings just by rubbing their Aneros, which I think comes from the motion of lubing it up before a session, and a strong association between this preparation and the pleasure that follows. It's likely that with enough repetition, the other cues could work pretty well.
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