Quick and Dirty Path to the Super-O

One more thing. Contracting with 70-80% for 30 seconds seems a lot and lets my muscles get tired pretty quickly. When I tried all that in my last session I experienced the most body movement so far but in terms of pleasure it was only 5th best or so.

Hello Rod of Plastic, 🙂

What I meant is that I thought that the anal group is the one called rectal and the other way around...

I don't believe this is so. If you go back and re-read the other descriptions in this thread of which contraction is which, you'll see that it lines up with what I'm saying.

It's good to hear though that you've gotten some nice results from CaveOfMystery's tug-o-war concept. 🙂

Love_is

This should be a sticky. One of the best posts here I ever read!

Great post, Cave, and very descriptive. These physical cues along with the right mental attitude should go a long way to help many guys here.

Thanks for your informative and instructional post.

Guys! Pay attention, this is good stuff.

Cockadoodle

CaveOfMystery, and everybody else,

I have added a section in the Wiki that is adapted from COM's original post (slightly condensed and edited).

It is on the Advanced Skills page. See Tug-of-war.

Darwin

Cave,
Thanks for writing this. I've read almost everything here over the past couple of years, and nothing has even come close to explaining succinctly how to achieve a Super O. Even though I have been there on my own, I have played around with different positions, music, weed, time of day etc. and found all kinds of things that either work or don't After reading your post last week, I had time for a session this last weekend, and so I consciously followed your directions and immediately saw benefits. What was so interesting about it was that I was thinking in my head about steps to take etc. which would normally cause me to lose focus and have my session peter out. Not the case here. At any rate, we all know how hard it is to describe what is happening with Super O's and what is involved to get there; your post does this better than anything else and should be included in the packet insert sold with the Aneros.

I'm a bit puzzled right now since everyone talks from the rolling motion. In the OP it seems like this only serves as a training exercise so where is the point to use this motion during a session?

I'm with you grayfox. Cave, you state that when you are ready for something more, contract both your anal and PC muscles at about 70 to 80% and hold for about thirty seconds. I can only assume that you are talking about contracting them both SIMULTANEOUSLY in an effort to fatique them and start the fluttering.

AM I WRONG? OR SHOULD WE CONTRACT THEM IN THE ROLLING/ ALTERNATING MANNER INDIVIDUALLY FOR 30 SECONDS? THANKS FOR THE CLARIFICATION.

I'm with you grayfox. Cave, you state that when you are ready for something more, contract both your anal and PC muscles at about 70 to 80% and hold for about thirty seconds. I can only assume that you are talking about contracting them both SIMULTANEOUSLY in an effort to fatique them and start the fluttering.

AM I WRONG? OR SHOULD WE CONTRACT THEM IN THE ROLLING/ ALTERNATING MANNER INDIVIDUALLY FOR 30 SECONDS? THANKS FOR THE CLARIFICATION.

" Do light contractions of your anal sphincter, your PC muscle, etc. Test mobility, play... At this point you should have no particular goal other than get your bearings down there. Do the exercises you did without it in, note the sensations."

The training exercises, once mastered, are supposed to be done once the Aneros is in as a means of playing, teasing, mapping, experiencing. They'll no doubt bring you some measure of pleasure, the amount of which, will no doubt vary depending on which manipulation techniques your body likes best. Once the pump is primed so to speak, then move onto the contraction. And you are correct, it is a simultaneous contraction, that you then back off of unevenly, which is why you need independent control of each muscle. As each muscle group struggles for control that's when the fun begins. If it doesn't have the desired effect, then back to exercises, and once again play, tease, prime.

The execises can also be used in the throes of a Super-O to prolong it, increase its intensity, etc.

Thanks CaveOfMystery: From my journey so far, this is a better technique for me (type A) personality than just trying to relax and lay there. I have already had some flutters and some involuntaries. I am hoping for more with your excellent regime/instructions adding this to the deep relaxation.

On my second and third sessions using this technique I had some great P-waves but was unable to achieve any more involuntary contractions. But then I got the best ones yet on my fourth try, using the following variation. First, as Cave and others have said, it is important to master independent control of the anal sphincter and the PC muscles. I start with a few cycles of anal-rolling-into PC, then contract both, then I hold the PC at about 80% while very slowly repeatedly relaxing and contracting the anal sphincter (all the while holding fairly steady tension on the PC), until I find a critical “sweet spot” of tension. It’s a little like tuning a stringed instrument, finding the exact pitch that puts the “anal string” in harmony with the “PC string.” (In fact, I suspect that the desired result is a similar form of resonance). Then as the anal fatigue builds, the flutters start.
Right now that sweet spot is elusive and not always there, but I have a feeling it will get easier to find with practice.
It’s exciting to feel the muscle memory building, making the process a little easier each time.

Hey Woodsman. I think you and I started about the same time 10 months ago with all this. Just last month I reached the prostate orgasm stage, well worth all these months of work, so keep at it. Getting those involuntary contractions to come is the key, and the key word here is involuntary.

But, going back to the voluntary contractions, somewhere, I don't really remember, I read that the PC contraction was the "cutting off your urine mid stream" contraction and that the anal contraction was the "tightening your anus to keep a bowel movement or flatus from coming out" contraction--this being the same contraction you can voluntarily use to pull the Aneros "in"--and a rectal contraction is the contraction we're all familiar with that pushes out a bowel movement. And, most can train themselves, as I did and it greatly helped, to voluntarily hold a light to medium PC contraction without bringing an anal contraction into the process, though of course higher levels of PC contraction will cause the anus to contract also--that's just the way we're built down there.

As an exercise, try lightly contracting the muscles you would use to cut off your urine mid stream and hold that contraction a while without contracting or tightening your anus. If you're not sure of the muscle group involved, next time you have to pee, sit rather than stand, and while peeing, stop your stream at intervals with just enough muscle contraction to stop the flow of urine, but not enough to tighten up your anus. After a while you'll get really good at separating the PC and anal contractions and almost anytime at work or around the house you can practice and get really good at it. Then during a session, use these light to medium PC contractions, holding them awhile each time, and see what your Aneros does. It does take training, often months, and I think that's what the "rewiring" process is about, but eventually, holding these PC contractions with the Aneros in place will trigger a fatigue-like induced spasm or quivering of the external anal sphincter muscle, and with time and practice, the result of holding the PC contraction while the quivering is going on will be an involuntary sucking in of the massager into the rectum, not you voluntarily contracting your anus to pull it in. During this involuntary sucking in process, your rectum will involuntarily contract (you won't be pushing down voluntarily to do it) and it will feel like the massager is being clamped against your prostate and rubbing it (as with the larger massagers) or tickling it (as with the Eupho, my favorite).

When you reach this stage in the training process, orgasms occurring during sessions are not far away. Eventually (at least in my case it was this way) when you get to the stage of these involuntary sequences occurring in sessions, you should notice a warm sensation building in your pelvis kind of behind your pubic bone as the involuntary sucking in and clamping down on the massager phase of the process occurs. Don't force that feeling or take over with any voluntary contractions of your own, just tease at it gently and let it grow or fade as it will and eventually in sessions it will feel like it's able to move into the shaft of your penis and eventually to the traditional penis G-spot under the urethral opening at the end. At that stage it will often burst over into an awesome, like your ejaculating on yourself feeling that lasts much longer than traditional orgasm, and though it doesn't empty or satisfy you like a traditional orgasm (with its corresponding refractory period), it is intensely pleasureful and relaxing and leaves you wanting more.

Hey Woodsman. I think you and I started about the same time 10 months ago with all this. Just last month I reached the prostate orgasm stage, well worth all these months of work, so keep at it. Getting those involuntary contractions to come is the key, and the key word here is involuntary.

But, going back to the voluntary contractions, somewhere, I don't really remember, I read that the PC contraction was the "cutting off your urine mid stream" contraction and that the anal contraction was the "tightening your anus to keep a bowel movement or flatus from coming out" contraction--this being the same contraction you can voluntarily use to pull the Aneros "in"--and a rectal contraction is the contraction we're all familiar with that pushes out a bowel movement. And, most can train themselves, as I did and it greatly helped, to voluntarily hold a light to medium PC contraction without bringing an anal contraction into the process, though of course higher levels of PC contraction will cause the anus to contract also--that's just the way we're built down there.

As an exercise, try lightly contracting the muscles you would use to cut off your urine mid stream and hold that contraction a while without contracting or tightening your anus. If you're not sure of the muscle group involved, next time you have to pee, sit rather than stand, and while peeing, stop your stream at intervals with just enough muscle contraction to stop the flow of urine, but not enough to tighten up your anus. After a while you'll get really good at separating the PC and anal contractions and almost anytime at work or around the house you can practice and get really good at it.

Hey slimjm,

It's not clear how one gets from the state where the PC and anal muscles contract together, to where they don't. Can you clarify this?

What I notice in my case is that I can pretty much independently tighten the anal muscle without affecting the PC muscle. (But if I do it really hard, then the PC muscle clamps too.) But, if I try to contract the PC muscle, even lightly, I can feel the anal muscle contracting too.

Is there any magic way of reducing crosstalk between the PC and anal contractions, other than just doing contractions of the PC muscle, over and over, day after day, until suddenly magic happens?

Slimjm

It is great to hear you have made it to the orgasm level, it gives me confidence that I may not be far behind.
Thanks for the encouragement and the highly detailed process description. It adds to the value of this very useful thread. You touch on several points that I am now seeing are of critical importance.
The first is the learned ability to achieve a high level of isolation between the two muscles. Without this control, the stimulus cannot be sharply focused, and for me at least, has been insufficient to lift me to a higher level of arousal. Interestingly, I was telling my wife about this insight yesterday and she didn’t even realize the anal and PC muscles were separate. I think many of us have grown up blissfully ignorant of the fact. After all, the two muscle groups are only an inch or two apart, and we don’t think much about them as long as they do their mundane little jobs. I showed her how the PC contractions made my erect penis twitch, while anal contraction barely made it move (one good exercise is to repeatedly contract and relax the anal sphincter without causing major twitching of the erection – I’m still working on this). It helps for me to move my mental focus from anus to penis as I shift the contractions forward; focusing on the penis helps “pull” the tactile sensation away from the anus and toward the PC. It’s very similar to the kind of thinking process when learning to swing a golf club.

Another important point you touch on is the “teasing” of that magic feeling. It’s hard to overstress it’s fragility, how easily it can be smothered, like the tiniest candle flame, by excessive eagerness or impatience. Over the past few months, when that sensation appears, I have learned to just lie there and marvel at the wonder of it, that it exists at all, telling myself that it will grow when it’s ready. As it flickers, one can gently explore its boundaries with the tiniest muscle contractions.

Finally, I am very interested in your last sentence describing an awesome feeling that is not really an orgasm but carries great pleasure. This is very similar to the sensation I wrote about a year ago, even before I knew about the Aneros. I’m calling it sub-orgasmic bliss. After a few times back then it went away, leaving me disappointed, but it’s back now, I can call it up easily, usually with my wife’s help. After some specific manual stimulation I lie back and close my eyes, and I can prolong it for many minutes. It seems to float above my pelvis like a plasma, sustained by my mind, which goes into a mild trance-like state. Aside from the fact that there are no involuntary contractions, it is nearly as good as a traditional orgasm. And as you describe, it leaves me full of vitality and wanting more. I have been planning to write up a post on this phenomenon after spending some time learning more about it. It’s too bad our language lacks specific words for these sensations.

question for the participants of this thread: which part of the aneros would you say touches your internal g-spot? the hump in the middle or more towards the tip?

darwin

[COLOR="#ff0000"]Darwin.

The tip I feel is the closest part of the Aneros stimulating the rectal wall up against the prostate gland. It feels that the middle hump of the Aneros stimulates the nerve receptors closer to the anal sphincter. It's the middle part of the device that seems to drive the anal orgasms while the tip perpetuates the prostate ones. I always viewed the Aneros as a more stylized finger. The tip of the Aneros is like the phalange of the finger. I try to move the device in a come hither motion using my rectal muscles. I get loosened up and relaxed when the middle part of the device rolls in a wave motion against the sphincter and rectal area. I think since the prostate gland is on the other side of the rectal wall, it takes more direct pressure from the tip of the product to press into the rectal tissue lying against the prostate gland in order to feel the necessary pressure. This is just based on my experience however.

Hey Woodsman and Optimus. I hope I can satisfactorily explain my way out of the PC vs anal contractions corner I narrated myself into. With the benefit of some on line medical information I read tonight and some reflection on personal experience, here goes.

Though a number of articles and contributors refer to Kegels and PC muscle strengthening in a general sense without distinguishing between PC and anal contractions, several point out that with practice, the PC contraction can be isolated to at least a significant extent from the general contraction that tightens both the urinary and anal sphincters that are located near each other in that area. The overall impression I get is that with practice, you can contract the PC muscle group that controls the urinary sphincters with relatively little anal contraction at least to the level of light to medium PC muscle contractions. To pull really hard contractions with the PC muscle group you will not be able to avoid a pretty strong anal contraction becoming a component of that. The medical reason is that the group of muscles involved runs from the pubic bone in front through the pelvic floor under the prostate, then around the anus as the levator ani muscle, finally connecting to the coccyx and lower sacrum in back with no separate innervation of individual parts of it, that is which would permit you to contract your urinary sphincter entirely separately from your anus or vice versa. However, the innervation does permit training (such as with "Kegels") that can allow more urinary sphincter contraction than anal sphincter contraction at lighter levels of PC contraction, hence the concept of "isolating" the PC muscle contraction from the anal contraction. As one of the articles illustrated, and I tried this, you can put your finger on your anus and try PC contractions of varying levels and see what you feel. At light to medium PC contraction levels you might feel a flicker of tightening of your anus but when you "pull in" really hard with your PC muscles, you'll feel your anus tighten strongly. In Aneros sessions, it's the use of the lighter PC contractions that involve imperceptible degrees of anal tightening to nurture that whimsical involuntary anal fluttering into a full blown involuntary rectal contraction that massages the prostate with the Aneros producing an orgasm.

Another interesting, though non-Aneros related connection between urinary and anal sphincter tone mentioned in some of the information I read is the concept of the ano-urethral reflex. Turns out they did research and verified medically what we already know from when we get up early in the morning and have to pee and take a dump really bad at the same time, that one or the other will occur first, but never both simultaneously. Turns out research showed that defecating which involves a relaxed anus tightens the tone of the urinary sphincter and conversely, urinating which requires a relaxed urinary sphincter tightens the anal sphincter tone, which maybe explains why those who relish passing flatus audibly while urinating can only do so near the end of voiding. I know of no direct applicability this concept has to Aneros usage, but these numerous relationships between the two sphincters suggest that the function of one can't be totally isolated from that of the other.

As to accomplishing the "isolation" of PC muscle from anal contractions, I know of no magic way to attain skill at that other than with practice, and using an Aneros seems to be one of the best ways to do that and I would think probably affords more success than doing Kegel exercises alone. When I started my journey last summer, I could only vaguely "pull in with everything down there" but now have a much more specific feel for that isolation.

Being able to release the PC muscle has been my bane, making the epherial Super-O so elusive. I can easily stop the stream, but being able to relax and get it to start back up again has been my problem.

Thank you Cave for this thread. It is by far the most informative and interesting thread to hit this forum since Cockadoodle’s “Penis Not”.

For more years than I can possibly remember, I have been conscientiously doing my PC exercises, but have now learned from your post #38 to this thread that I have been all this time, doing them incorrectly!

I have been trying to identify the difference between the PC and the anal sphincter muscles. So last night, I stuck the middle finger of one hand up my bum while emptying my bladder, and used the PC muscles to arrest the flow of urine several times. I found that whenever I contracted the PC muscles, I found the sphincter closed around my inserted finger. It is apparent that my system has learned that the PC and sphincter muscles operate as one muscle system. From what you have said, I need now to separate the two so that I can operate them independently.

This led to me working out a routine by which one might make the necessary identification of the two muscle systems individually. Here it is:

[COLOR="red"]Start by consuming a meal consisting of one complete 8oz (250gm) can of baked beans. Wash down this meal with at least two large glasses of beer. This will have the effect of simultaneously filling the bladder with urine and the colon with a large volume of gas.
Resist the temptation to go to the toilet for as long as is humanly possible. When you can no longer withstand the agony of holding back both the pee and the gas, go to the toilet. Once there, carefully begin to relieve the bladder, but for no longer than one or two seconds. Stop the flow using the PC muscle. Once the flow has stopped, release a tiny little fart through the anal sphincter. Stop the gas flow and then repeat the release of a very small amount of urine from the bladder. Continue to alternate between pissing and farting until both the bladder and the colon are empty.

If you were unable to successfully carry out the above procedure, repeat daily until you have completely mastered the skill of identifying the difference between the PC muscle group and the anal sphincter muscle group.

NB: It is vitally important that at no time during this exercise do you allow yourself to piss and fart simultaneously!

HEEHAW BLAZING SADDLES!!!

Seriously though, if anyone on the forum can come up with a suggestion as to how I might be able to separate contractions of the PC muscles from contractions of the anal sphincter muscle, I would be most grateful to hear it.

PS: Having written this I have just discovered a whole heap of posts from slimjm, Woodsman et al that may go some way to answering my query. Will now go and read them!! I just felt we need to bring a little levity into all this serious stuff!

Pommie

Slimjm:
More good information, from which I think we can infer a couple of things. First, it is physiologically possible to achieve through practice a reasonable degree of isolation between the two muscle groups; second, it is not possible to achieve total isolation,so we shouldn't wear ourselves out trying. Fortunately, that may not be too much of a problem because the optimum range of contractions for most of us is probably below the levels at which isolation becomes impossible.
Who knew these humble little muscles would one day become the subject of such conversations?

Darwin: I can’t say I even know what part of the aneros touches my g-spot. Something to think about next time. I’m still at the point where each time I insert it I am amazed at the delicious sensitivity compared to ten months ago, when I seriously wondered if I even had a prostate.

Pommie: I think you’re really on to something with that routine, I’m sure you will want to prepare a video for us. It could be Oscar material.

slimjm,

I should have read your latest offerings before pasting in my effort above. I didn't mean to be frivolous.

I really do think you have answered my serious question and I look forward to putting into practice what you have so clearly described. Will keep you informed. Very many thanks!

Pommie

I just can't help myself but this stuff works 100%. I've done the contraction exercises to be able to isolate both muscles (actually, I could do this before but wasn't aware of it) and followed Cave's instructions during my session. I've never had so much control over my feelings and pleasure and I could force orgasm after orgasm. I'm not yet at a point where those are totally mind blowing but this way I still have a goal to work on 😉

Thanks for sharing this Cave, this is really pure gold.

Ok, I've now tried to apply the TOW technique with both Progasm and Helix. With Helix, I noticed that a sort of "natural hold/tension" needs to be factored in. In short: Progasm has a more wide stem that also thins less towards the base, which means the sphincter muscles need to apply more force to achieve an inward motion for the massager. But with Helix, the stem is considerably thinner than the head, and also terminates to a very thin base, where the handle/p-tab branch off.

This means that for me, pushing the massager in or holding it in place with the sphincter muscles requires exceedingly little effort. Noticing this, I didn't try to apply similar force to the both muscle sets, but comparatively more to the rectal ones, which push the massager out. This lead to an increase in pleasure similar to my initial TOW trial with the Progasm.

What this means that to achieve the optimal TOW tension, the shape of the massager needs to considered, and also the mileage the user has had with the model. Why? Because I think that almost universally when an Aneros model is inserted for the first few times, the rectal muscles are more resistant, more willing to cause involuntary push outwards on the massager. Happened to me with both Helix and Progasm, and also explains why my first few sessions with both models were the most pleasurable ones, before starting to experiment on TOW, that is.

No apology necessary, Pommie. The frivolity was a welcomed break in this otherwise tedious discussion about "isolating" the PC contractions from anal contractions. I agree Woodsman, I don't think there's a way they can be completely isolated one from the other, but getting familiar with low levels of contraction, mentally focusing on the PC muscle group (as if tightening your bladder sphincter) without so much tightening of your anal sphincter, is the key to getting the Aneros to trigger the best responses. When you think about it, it's the PC muscles that do the contractions in traditional orgasm that are necessary for you to ejaculate, not the anus muscle, though it comes along for the ride as anyone that has put a finger back there when ejaculation was taking place could attest to. Here's something else to try that can help with "isolating" the two areas. Put a couple fingers of one hand on your sweet spot where the P-tab normally contacts and with a finger of your other hand feel your anal sphincter and try doing the PC contraction lightly. You should be able to feel your PC muscle under your sweet spot contract with only mild tightening of your anus. With stronger contractions both areas will contract tightly. As Woodsman pointed out, the low levels of PC contractions necessary for effective Aneros usage are at the range that this relative "isolation" becomes possible.

I'm glad I decided to check into the forum and read this post. This is really helpful information.. As someone who's struggling, it looks like very helpful, practical advise. I'm enjoying the feeling of the aneros, but patiently waiting for a response. I'll start putting these suggestions into practice.

Restorme
If it had not been for this forum, I probably would have given up on the aneros a few weeks after buying it, because I, along with most of the unenlightened out there, had no way to even imagine what it could do. I am still early on the journey, but even if I never go farther than I am now, it has been totally worth it. Your patience will be rewarded.

Note that Cave has just added an addendum to his original post, a tip about tickling your tip.

To that, let me add this suggestion. Another trick to accelerate things is to contract your cremaster. that is the muscle that pulls your balls up, which is what happens as the first phase of ejaculatory inevitability. if you learn to control that you can give yourself a big nudge by doing it voluntarily, in conjunction with the rest of the proceedings.

darwin

Again I find myself offering sincere thanks to Cave and to slimjm and others for this thread. What an absolute gem it is.

Over recent nights I have been putting together the advice given here and have immediately seen the benefits.

A couple of nights ago, I used the modified Eupho (it has its handle removed), to do some exercises to separate the PC muscles from the anal sphincter group. I will admit that I wasn’t sure at the end of that couple of hours how successful it was, but the proof came the following night.

The next night I decided to see if I could build on the previous one and it paid off in spades! This time I used the modified Helix (also without its handle). After about half an hour of similar practice to the previous night, I rested for half an hour and then resumed the exercises. Within minutes I found myself in my “near-orgasm zone”, (NOZ). I could hardly believe that I was able to stay in that zone continuously for the next hour and a half. During that time I experienced at least a dozen and possibly fifteen anal orgasms (mini-Os). During the first of these, I had involuntary spasms of the entire pelvic region that continued for at least three or four minutes. I admit that the remaining orgasms were not quite as strong but was amazed that they just kept coming. During the first half hour, I was lying on my right side. I then rolled over onto my back, (a manoeuvre which usually breaks the cycle). This gave me the freedom to try some nipple stimulation. That added to the process and ensured that I stayed in the NOZ. I then rolled over onto my left side and stayed in the NOZ, enjoying another half dozen anal orgasms. After that, I rolled back onto my back but mistress Helix was not done with me yet. I had one more orgasm before having the strength of will to call a halt to the proceedings lest I should collapse from fatigue! I call to mind BF Mayfields description of his first forays into Super-O territory.

I’m not sure how it could get better than this. For the present though, I am perfectly happy to enjoy this level of pleasure.

Pommie

CaveOfMystery......Fantastic advice! Your spot on! I followed your advice step by step and BAM I was able to with some practice create the rolling sequence of contracting the sphincter first then the pc muscle. Man....incredible. I was able to enjoy those powerful waves of pleasure, so intense, back to back as I was finally in THE ZONE! Thanks CaveOfMystery for unlocking the mystery for me!

...eventually, holding these PC contractions with the Aneros in place will trigger a fatigue-like induced spasm or quivering of the external anal sphincter muscle, and with time and practice, the result of holding the PC contraction while the quivering is going on will be an involuntary sucking in of the massager into the rectum, not you voluntarily contracting your anus to pull it in. During this involuntary sucking in process, your rectum will involuntarily contract (you won't be pushing down voluntarily to do it) and it will feel like the massager is being clamped against your prostate and rubbing it (as with the larger massagers) or tickling it (as with the Eupho, my favorite).

When you reach this stage in the training process, orgasms occurring during sessions are not far away.

Well, I sure hope so, slimjm, because that's just where I'm at now in my rewiring journey, which thankfully only started several weeks ago. As eloquent and invaluable as Cave's post is, I am also truly impressed slimjm with your ability to even more clearly articulate the action of these muscle groups. As soon as I read Cave's post, like Strongone I was "rolling" along beautifully (although I'm a bit embarrassed to admit that, for whatever reason, it's much more natural for me to "roll from PC to anal" than vice versa...same effect, though). Then, in the last two nights, as p-waves (or anal mini-O's? Who cares!) were hitting me, I felt the absolutely delicious "clamping" of the MGX against the prostate that you described. It felt SO MUCH BETTER than the prostate contact that I'd previously "cheaply obtained" by anal contractions alone or by sitting up straight in bed to feel the massager pushed hard against my prostate.

Thanks, Cave and slimjm, for adding to the "canon of the greats" on this forum and helping bring new clarity for those of us wandering along on our journey.

And thanks Pommie for the "beans and beer" post. I was reading through it quite seriously and when I (duh) got the joke, and had the best, longest laugh I've had in ages...frankly, almost as satisfying as a p-wave!

Tallguy

Cave - Thanks for this insightful post. I was able to produce the flutter you spoke about - this is great!!

Question to everyone: Whenever I start to get any "excitement" back there, my penis starts to get erect (this can also feel very good). Once this happens I lose my ability to feel or "hold the imbalance" of the contractions. Does anyone else experience this? Any suggestions? I would say I get pleasurable sensations but they seem the most intense when I get an erection - once this happens though I cannot hold the intensity.