Mindgasm / Secret Muscle

Hey guys,

Quick update (that nobody asked for). I reached out to the creator of Mindgasm and linked him this thread. He was very pleased about the resonance and may post here himself in the future.

Take care,
Unfug

@unfug

I figured by enough I meant enough to make any tangible progress, but I guess my question was way to vague lol.

Anyway, I believe that with structured practice (using the third mindgasm lesson) at least every other day I ought to develop some ability to separate the muscles over time even if it takes a while.

Being able to contract PC without puckering my sphincter seems kind of unreal to me the way it works right now, but then again I used to not be able to do pullups either and now I can do at least 5 in a row.

Posted by: @aneros_user88299

Being able to contract PC without puckering my sphincter seems kind of unreal to me the way it works right now, but then again I used to not be able to do pullups either and now I can do at least 5 in a row.

It's just a matter of time. You will master this sooner that you think, as long as you are sticking to a practice.

Hey there! 
That thread was a nice discovery, thx @ unfuq for notifying me! 
I've commented on some points raised here

Love,

Allie  (◦‿◦)

Sorry to be a party pooper. Would love to try this but I find the female voice grates after awhile. I find it odd a female voice describing what is fundamentally something only a male can experience.

Posted by: @unfug

To be fair though, I'm pretty sure I'm alone with this puristic position. And most of the others here get along quite well w/o a fetish for precise muscle control.

I find the muscle separation thing very interesting. I think it's possible that we're not all wired the same way when it comes to "contracting the PC muscle"... maybe when I contract the whole muscle group, more or less tension is going to one muscle or another... and maybe that default distribution is different for someone else. Also consider different levels of muscle development, especially if you've been training for a long time with a bias/leaning towards one kind.

I've found contractions to be very confusing to talk about... every kegel tutorial tells you to "locate the PC muscle" by cutting off urine flow. Do they mean to exercise that exact same muscle? Or am I just using that familiar contraction to get in the general neighborhood and exercise the whole pelvic floor? I don't know what to focus on, because I could focus primarily on the "piss stopper" or bias it more towards the front where I feel the contraction more in my penis. I don't claim to have full separation/control, but I can definitely lean one way or another.

Posted by: @clenchy

I've found contractions to be very confusing to talk about... every kegel tutorial tells you to "locate the PC muscle" by cutting off urine flow. Do they mean to exercise that exact same muscle?

Yeah, that's my personal pet peeve: the oversimplification of the whole Levator Ani group under the label "the PC-muscle™".

Posted by: @clenchy

Or am I just using that familiar contraction to get in the general neighborhood and exercise the whole pelvic floor?

I suspect that it's pretty much this for the majority of riders, yes.

Posted by: @clenchy

I don't claim to have full separation/control, but I can definitely lean one way or another.

Leaning is good already. You can build on that and just practice to lean better. But you don't have to. But you could, if you wanted... 🙂

Hey,

I just read about the "mindgasm" and as it sounds like the male vagus technique I wrote I thought I should offer some insights. First and foremost: I don't have anything against them selling the mindgasm training as long as they don't sue me later. 😀 I mean, you could also see it that way: They don't sell the technique but rather the work they invested creating their sound files, website and to create an accesible training overall. You could also say about f.e. authors who write about yoga, that they stole someones ideas and techniqes - but that would'nt be quite right.

And If that means that they are able to spread the word, even better! The vagus-nerve techniqe really helped me to kickstart my aneros and a-less abilities back then - many months before I even wrote my technique down. You could say, that this technique alone turned me from a complete beginner (who couldn't even generate pleasurable feelings with my aneros) to an advanced user who could generate aless orgasms in a few seconds and aneros super-o's in a few minutes. So If you want to spread the knowledge about this profound technique: All power to you.

https://community.aneros.com/community/general-discussion/a-male-vagus-nerve-experiment/

@darkorb do you have the male vagus nerve post somewhere?  It’s no longer available.  Thanks for your contribution!!

Posted by: @unfug

What leaves me sceptic a bit, is the apparent vagueness regarding the muscles.

My opinion is imprecision is ok since each person needs to find their own truth as to activating the muscle groups- yes I feel base and center with exception of the top to be groups- and how they respond.  The main thing is to give people a point of departure upon which they can attach their curiousity, and then explore.

It is confusing to initiates.  I liken the felt-anatomy to a stack of 3 saucers set at the base, center, and top.  But it isn’t totally vertical- it leans towards the navel.

I think the top is the levator prostatae, something I mentioned in the 3/18/22 post at Helical’s beginnings.  There and here I will thank @unfug and @darkorb for teaching me some practical anatomy through their postings.

I believe Aneros and Mindgasm approaches to be complementary.  For one, @heghast ‘s anchored tension is helped along through the partial independence between base and center when you work/“roll” through free Mindgasm Lesson 3.  For another, it’s fun to do a Mindgasm squeeze with Aneros inside.

@aneros_user88299, @unfug is right, you can master it (piss-stopper without butt-pucker lol), it’s just practice.

@goanfaster I hope it’s just a temporary site bug that the excellent resource is unavailable.  And thanks for bubbling this topic up- it has been fun to think about from where I am in my Aneros/Aless development, along with having several Mindgasm lessons and repetitions under my belt.  Oh, and welcome to the Forum if no one has greeted you yet!

Above I mentioned @helghast ‘s anchored tension, correcting his name here so that he’s properly referenced.

@anerosit , it is one of those fairly recent site bugs such that it is impossible to scroll to edit a previously-posted entry while on the iOS Safari browser.  And the textbox is visually noisy with all manner of markup text and not simply the words themselves.  Thank you.

@goanfaster - There were two versions of the vagus post by DarkOrb.

Here is the first one he did from 4-23-2016.
https://community.aneros.com/forum/general-discussion/how-to-have-a-less-orgasms-almost-instantly-male-vagus-nerve-orgasms/

He did a re-write 2-14-2021 & this one is missing in action.  I searched the forum & did not find it. 

DarkOrb hasn't been around much lately.  I hope he shows up soon.  In light of that, I will post a copy of his re-write below.  Thankfully I kept a copy.

Edit note Sat.102922:  Forum software update required link edit.

A Male Vagus Nerve Experiment - originally posted by DarkOrb 2-14-2021 (somehow lost)

You might be aware of my "male vagus nerve" thread:

https://community.aneros.com/forum/general-discussion/how-to-have-a-less-orgasms-almost-instantly-male-vagus-nerve-orgasms/

It involves squeezing an "imaginary muscle" at the top of the penis very very lightly while keeping other muscles relaxed. Now I found that especially beginners have some problems with this technique. Even I had a good struggle with my own technique after having to relearn basically everything from zero (after years of depression and bad penile activity habits). Now I might found out why: When I wrote the guide I actually wrote it from the standpoint of a skilled practioner who already isloated his top penis muscle. On my way to actually developing that technique I didn't pay any attention, on how I actually got there. When I was ready to actually write my guide, I already had full control of my "penis top muscle" (or as some people call it: "secret muscle") and neglected to write a muscle isolation part in my guide - the part that is very important for beginners. In my case a very, very, very weak squeeze was still enough to control the "secret muscle" to my desire. That wasn't possible though, if the "secret muscle" wasn't isolated. At this time I saw it as a given that people can control their "secret muscle" even with a very very light squeeze. But I was very wrong: I found out that if your "secret muscle" isn't isolated properly, it will be very hard to actually stimulate the part with very slight squeezes. It will feel like nothing at worst and like a very dull squeeze at best. Some happy folks might be able to actually activate the secret muscle that way and let it respond, but the majority won't feel more than a very dull, almost imaginary squeeze. At least that's my assumption.

I opened this thread to conduct an experiment to see, If I'm right with my assumption so that I ultimately have to write a new, more comprehensive guide. To make it short:

1. Squeeze your PC-muscle WHILE focussing on an imaginary muscle in your penis head in a rhythm of about 0.5 - 1.0 seconds. The squeeze should be around 50-70% strenght (you can also try 100% sometimes).
2. After a short amount time you will notice, that the squeeze will "move" up to your penis head. Keep squeezing though and focus on your penis head.
3. After a short amount time you will feel, that the squeeze will feel very different. It feels heavily located in your penis head and the squeeze will feel more "concentrated" (if that makes sense). That's the feeling that you activated the "secret muscle". You will now feel, that you are able to squeeze the secret muscle by itself.
4. Now that you have full control over your secret muscle, you can try to lower the intensity of the squeeze up to the point, that is very very light but still distinctly noticable.

You have to repeat step 1 - 4 every time you have an aless session. After some time (days or weeks) you will find that you trained and isolated your "secret muscle" so much, that you don't even need steps 1 - 4 anymore because you are now able to squeeze the "secret muscle" by itself.

Bonus: Once you are able to squeeze the "secret muscle" distinctly, you might try to focus on a imaginary spot a few milimeters or 1-2 centers above your penis root (in the direction of your belly button). Now repeat step 1-4 but with one little change: Squeeze the "secret muscle" (at this point you can try squeezes with a low intensity) and focus on the spot right above the penis root. You will find that you are able to now squeeze that spot above the penis root distinctly and by itself. Now squeeze that spot above the penis root by itself and focus on a spot that is even higher in the direction of your belly button (but not higher than 2cm!). This way you will be able to "move" that spot up and I found the higher the spot, more intense and full-body the orgasm.

Glandrake note:  @darkorb I meant no disrespect by posting this.  I was only trying to help out a fellow traveler.  If you object to my doing so I will gladly remove it.  Simply say the word here or in a private message.  There will be no hard feelings on my end.

Edit note Sat.102922:  Forum software update required link edit.

Posted by: @helical

My opinion is imprecision is ok since each person needs to find their own truth as to activating the muscle groups- yes I feel base and center with exception of the top to be groups- and how they respond.  The main thing is to give people a point of departure upon which they can attach their curiousity, and then explore.

I think you are on to something here, as long as you can find 3 (or even 2) distinct things to squeeze, going from the anus towards the glans, you're bound to be doing something right. Then once you can get some involuntary action going, it really does not matter what is precisely happening. Of course if you can isolate the exact three "right" things, it will probably work a little bit better.  

Pressing your fingers in there is the easiest way to find and lock it in. I said before elsewhere it’s good to press on muscles and you can feel them working. Really helps the mind muscle connection.

I pee into a container at night on my side in bed when I go down for the evening.  I put an aneros in me almost every night and fall asleep with it in most of the time.  I think of it as a pasafire, you see l always had a hard time falling to sleep sometimes laying in bed for hours, and sometimes I would Jack-off when I wasn't even horny just to fall asleep.  Now I look forward to bed just as I look forward to another new day.  Any way last night when I was peeing I would stop and restart the flo. Stopping it with the most slightest contraction.  I believe that was when I first experienced that secret muscle.  All night long I was able to kick start a good thing just by a slight pinch and hold and then some short hip thrusts and it was off to the races. 

PS, I do realize that using every night is not the path to the Supper O, but I get a good night's sleep.  With many exceptions when I ride for hours.